Curse

pumpkin pie · Feb 22, 2009, 02:10 AM // 02:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by maraxusofk

Because getting protector is easy?

Because reading is hard??

The person is asking this in regards to someone with learning disability.

Reagan,
I think, an alternate solution that you can do at this point, is to tell your daughter that you need help with your HM missions/vanquishing, list down all the places you can work on together. When she gets Legendary Guardian, it would mean even more, i am sure there's a lot of players here who would help, you could ask them to go along, the GW Helper List

because I seriously doubt Arena Net would hear your request.

Reagan · Feb 22, 2009, 03:25 AM // 03:25

A lot of comments, so where to start...

pumpkin pie - Thanks that's a great idea! But the only thing is she wants to prove to herself that she's capable, so she doesn't really want my help. I might be able to turn it around, though, and ask her for help. I hadn't thought of that.
Unfortunately, there are many people out there who can't tolerate her disability when playing and so she has learned to play with just heroes and henchies. It's like there's no MMO as far as she is concerned. But thank you! I might just try that. Thanks for the GW Helper link, too. I didn't know about that.

ShadowbaneX - Thank you, too, for your comments. I hadn't actually thought of that. It would be interesting! lol

Roman - No offense taken. I honestly don't expect ANet to do anything about this, but sometimes people just need to be educated about situations that they might not have thought about. It's not meant as a slam to ANet. Like I said, I like GW and I love to play it when I can. So, I'm just bringing another group of people who are playing this game to their attention...that's all.

Nerel - So which campaign did you start with? Not Prophecies, I'm guessing, because there weren't any heroes back then. So, you must have had SOME interaction with real people.

And GWAMM is special to those of us who haven't reached that level yet. Don't take your talents for granted. Everyone isn't as blessed as you seem to be. But thank you for the encouraging comments you made at the end of your post.

She'd just like to see herself as a normal person achieving the same titles everyone else has, so she is proud of what she's done. It's just a shame she has to do it alone.

DragonRogue - Thanks for everything you said! The only thing that probably won't work is like I said above. Most people don't have the patience to play with her because she doesn't have the capability to pay attention to everything that the rest of us grinding for titles can, so they have kicked her from their group, not played with her, made rude comments, etc. She has resorted to playing with just heroes and henchies, and it makes me sad for her. She understands that she is different because of their lack of understanding and now plays alone. Sometimes we play together, but she wants to prove to herself that she can do it, so that's how she handles it.

And I know ANet isn't going to change anything because of this thread, but I have to at least try. If those of us who are capable, don't advocate for those who can't or don't know how, then what will this world come to? And maybe someone will see this and think twice before making a rude comment to the next person they play with who isn't quite as good as they are. So, maybe it will help the GW community a little. That's my hope, anyway.

Thank you all for your comments. I appreciate the feedback very much!

pingu666 · Feb 22, 2009, 06:12 AM // 06:12

if she can use vent/teamspeak, i think she would be welcome to join in with my guild when we do stuff

pm me if you two are interested

shoyon456 · Feb 22, 2009, 09:30 AM // 09:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by pumpkin pie

The person is asking this in regards to someone with learning disability.

And this is the problem. I may have gone along with the idea of a "Legendary Protector" title simply on the grounds of common sense, even though it would make GWAMM easier.

However games do not cater to people with learning disabilities because they are going to HAVE to be complicated to some limited degree, and changing game mechanics specifically for ppl with learning disabilities can sacrifice part of the intricate beauty of said game.

A title mechanic should not be changed because someone with a learning disability can't tackle a mission where everything is a few levels higher and the monsters have a fastcast, damage buff, better AI and better skills. Especially because titles are not necessary to play the game in the first place.

Especially with builds like SY/IMBAgon and the still viable Ursan, HM is a joke where even the most moronic five-year-old noob can succeed. All of those builds basically involve pressing 1-2-3-(and this one gets tricky)-4

Oh, but yeah some places in Eotn on hardmode... think before you LEEEERRROYYYY!

glacialphoenix · Feb 22, 2009, 09:56 AM // 09:56

Quote:

The only thing that probably won't work is like I said above. Most people don't have the patience to play with her because she doesn't have the capability to pay attention to everything that the rest of us grinding for titles can, so they have kicked her from their group, not played with her, made rude comments, etc.

*facepalm

I'm sorry to hear that. Some people need more sympathy. That being said, though, GW is currently already in a stage where most players are experienced enough and simply want speedruns. In that scenario, your daughter just doesn't fit in. Making a Legendary Protector title wouldn't change that attitude. It's unfortunate, yes, but it is difficult to change the attitudes of people who are going to view your daughter as a burden.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reagan

But the only thing is she wants to prove to herself that she's capable, so she doesn't really want my help.

And IMO that makes her a better player than the people who camp in Ascalon and Kamadan and Shing Jea begging for help.

<--- IGN here, poke me if I'm online and I'll gladly help you if/when I'm free. Well, I say help - I'm mostly glad to have a chance to redo the missions with other people. They get very dreary when I'm h/hing.

EDIT: The Legendary Protector (1) sounds like a pretty good idea, yes.

Eragon Zarroc · Feb 22, 2009, 10:44 AM // 10:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerel

GWAMM hasn't been 'special' for quite sometime, arguably since the release of EotN.

Making title achievement easier devalues the effort of those who aren't special needs cases.

so if the title isn't special, how can the effort be of any value? please revise ur previous statements, ty.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ShadowbaneX

I kinda thought that is should have been Legendary Protector (1) and then Legendary Guardian (2).

Get a title for actually doing all the missions (with bonus or with Master's) but not just adding another max title.

definitely the best solution. Legendary(1) to show that u have done all the NM missions. Legendary (2) to show that u have done all NM and HM. Only Legendary (2) count as max. allows a proper title that should exist to be there while preventing the addition of more max titles.

Reagan · Feb 22, 2009, 01:49 PM // 13:49

To shoyon456 - Go back to my original post on the thread. I simply questioned if it would be a good idea for a Legendary Protector title. When people started to comment, I felt it might be a good idea to state the reason for my thinking. I still think it would be a good idea, disability or not. So that's why I started the thread in the first place. So, thanks for what you said, but it was originally an idea for something that ANet might not have thought about. That's all it was.

To glacialphoenix - Thank you, you're right. And just to make things clear, she doesn't ever ask to be run through any mission. I know you didn't say that, but I'm making it clear so others understand.
She loves playing the game and fighting through each mission/quest. People with disabilities quite often go above and beyond (which might just be everyone else's normal) to prove that they can do it. That's what she's all about. And for that reason, I think she's pretty great! But also for that reason, I think there could be a Legendary Protector title. Call me a weird parent. lol But you are very correct when you say that people view her as a burden.

To Eragon - I like that. Like I said, my original post was just to see if it's possible and what others thought about it.

For the most part, it seems that a fair amount of people think it would be a nice idea to have a Legendary Protector title. Well, let's see what ANet thinks. I know they don't want to focus on this atm, but who knows?

Thank you!

Vamis Threen · Feb 22, 2009, 01:57 PM // 13:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nerel

GWAMM hasn't been 'special' for quite sometime, arguably since the release of EotN.

Maybe my memory is faulty here, but I dont think you could get GWAMM before the release of EOTN..... therefore since it is now "attainable" it isnt "special" anymore?

Arduin · Feb 22, 2009, 02:07 PM // 14:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vamis Threen

Maybe my memory is faulty here, but I dont think you could get GWAMM before the release of EOTN..... therefore since it is now "attainable" it isnt "special" anymore?

EotN made Hardmode a joke, with Ursan, other PvE skills and Consumables. Killroy's Dungeon makes Legendary Survivor an easy to obtain title too.

Vamis Threen · Feb 22, 2009, 02:18 PM // 14:18

My point was that there were not enough titles (ones that coulkd be maxed out, anyway) for it to be possible to get GWAMM before EotN was released.

DragonRogue · Feb 22, 2009, 02:32 PM // 14:32

[QUOTE=ShadowbaneX;4503647]I kinda thought that is should have been Legendary Protector (1) and then Legendary Guardian (2).

Get a title for actually doing all the missions (with bonus or with Master's) but not just adding another max title.QUOTE]

This is such a novel idea that I would recommend taking this to Sardelac and start a new thread and poll there. This would keep the mechanic of the GWAMM and allow the players acknowledgement for completing the 3 campaigns in NM.

Improvavel · Feb 22, 2009, 02:39 PM // 14:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by DragonRogue

This would keep the mechanic of the GWAMM and allow the players acknowledgement for completing the 3 campaigns in NM.

Because if other people doesn't acknowledge it you haven't done it...

I guess it is like "If it isn't on the new it hasn't happened".

I was from a time where people played for fun, guess they play for showing their "carrots". I'm getting to old...

Reagan · Feb 22, 2009, 02:56 PM // 14:56

LOL! NEVER acknowledge that you're getting too old! :P

But anyway...
ShadowbaneX and DragonRogue...I LOVE it! I'll support it!

DragonRogue · Feb 22, 2009, 03:01 PM // 15:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Improvavel

Because if other people doesn't acknowledge it you haven't done it...

I guess it is like "If it isn't on the new it hasn't happened".

I was from a time where people played for fun, guess they play for showing their "carrots". I'm getting to old...

Does anyone ever really read the whole post thread around here? you take one snippit of a whole thought and then flame it to living hell. Some people should just let others assume that they are stupid instead of opening their mouth and proving it.

The thread is about acknowledging a players achievement in a game. This person being one who has a disability where this title would make her feel better about the challenges she has over come to play this game. Im seriously so sick of everyone saying how easy it is to play this game, get some title, do this or that. YOU ARE NOT THE ONE WITH THE DISABILITY SO NO ONE CARES THAT YOU CAN DO THIS GAME OR ANYTHING IN IT. Seriously what do you really care if Anet decided to split the legendary title into two parts so that ANYONE could feel a bit better about thier achievements in this game. REALLY WOULD IT KILL YOU? Would you feel that you were robbed by this somehow? Would we really care how you felt? The lack of compassion in this thread is just sickening. Get a life people and try and put yourself in this girls spot for once instead of your selfish high horse mentality.

Improvavel · Feb 22, 2009, 03:45 PM // 15:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by DragonRogue

Snip

So you are saying that person will be happier if you sing and clap when she overcomes her difficulties as opposed to her personal satisfaction of overcoming them?

Sincerely, if I was the person having a disability, I would bite off the head of the OP by daring to insinuate I need a dumb version of the game and then I need cookies and sweets!

Providing support and advice, if requested, is something else.

No, I wouldn't have any problem if the title had a legendary protector and a legendary guardian, if they counted as 1 or 2 for koabd title either, neither I would care if there was no title at all.

If the op was asking why there isn't a title I would have stayed out of this discussion as I don't see a problem either way.

But by relating that to a disability, it made me sad.

As people have said, better to ask for help (and help as in "lets do it together" instead of "sit there quiet and I will do it for you cause you are too dumb").

I bet I know why that person prefers to do her stuff on her own, regardless of it being harder!

Actually, that person, despite her problems, seems to have fiber and would be most likely a pleasant person to spent time playing with. I feel this thread is a disservice to her.

glacialphoenix · Feb 22, 2009, 04:11 PM // 16:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Improvavel

I was from a time where people played for fun, guess they play for showing their "carrots".

I'm of the opinion that "carrots" give people a motivation to play. You can play for fun and your "carrot" at the same time.

Something like Legendary Protector (1) does not change any existing title mechanic (it wouldn't contribute to GWAMM, because you need Legendary Guardian for it to count as a max title), and it merely acknowledges what you would have to do in order to get said Legendary Guardian anyway.

Considering it's not that hard a title to achieve, it wouldn't have much of an epeen status anyway. For players who don't want HM/are new/can't do HM etc., it's a nice achievement to look at. It's been brought up in various threads that GWAMM is a daunting task for people who are new. Many of the GWAMM titles were done over time: Protectors, Cartographers, Skill Hunter etc before HM/NM came around. I think Legendary Protector would make things feel a bit friendlier and more encouraging, and maybe provide a bit of incentive for new players to keep playing and improving.

It's a small thing, yes. For many people, KOABD1 is really nothing much. I know I didn't display mine, but when I first got it I felt a sense of achievement, and it was nice to see it on my screen. I consider Legendary Protector to be something along that line. Nothing really much in the big picture of things, especially considering the number of people who already have Legendary Guardian - but for those who don't, it's something encouraging to look at, nothing more.

EDIT: I don't think the OP is insinuating that his daughter needs a dumbed down version of the game. I've never read it that way. I think the daughter deserves a lot of credit for trying to find people to play with, and I seriously think that nobody here would offer to 'run' her, or 'do the mission' for her. That would be an insult. Why are you reacting as if everyone here is trying to discredit her?

Improvavel · Feb 22, 2009, 04:26 PM // 16:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by glacialphoenix

Why are you reacting as if everyone here is trying to discredit her?

Cause the OP said it would be a nice title for her since she has a learning disability.

It might not be said in that way but almost feels like "She has problems, why not give her a title to make her feel good?".

If the op had posted using your arguments, it would have been perfectly logical, but the OP use the daughter problem as an argument.

I wouldn't think his/her daughter would want any title made especially for her.

As a side note about the "carrot", some people aren't even satisfied with a "carrot". They need to show their "carrot" and want other people to admire it, but this is going off topic.

glacialphoenix · Feb 22, 2009, 04:30 PM // 16:30

...actually, the OP's first post didn't use his daughter as an argument, and even his later post with the daughter mentioned ran as:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reagan

I'm talking specifically about people like my daughter

Ah well, perhaps you and I just read it different ways. I'm not about to quarrel with you over that. :P

DragonRogue · Feb 22, 2009, 04:43 PM // 16:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Improvavel

So you are saying that person will be happier if you sing and clap when she overcomes her difficulties as opposed to her personal satisfaction of overcoming them?

Sincerely, if I was the person having a disability, I would bite off the head of the OP by daring to insinuate I need a dumb version of the game and then I need cookies and sweets!

Providing support and advice, if requested, is something else.

No, I wouldn't have any problem if the title had a legendary protector and a legendary guardian, if they counted as 1 or 2 for koabd title either, neither I would care if there was no title at all.

If the op was asking why there isn't a title I would have stayed out of this discussion as I don't see a problem either way.

But by relating that to a disability, it made me sad.

As people have said, better to ask for help (and help as in "lets do it together" instead of "sit there quiet and I will do it for you cause you are too dumb").

I bet I know why that person prefers to do her stuff on her own, regardless of it being harder!

Actually, that person, despite her problems, seems to have fiber and would be most likely a pleasant person to spent time playing with. I feel this thread is a disservice to her.

Maybe you should go back and reread everything the OP has said in her posts. Her daughter has finished all the protector titles on her own. Alone because due to this disability no one wants to play with her. She has never once asked for a ''dumbed down version'' of the game as you eloquently put it and nor has she asked for anyone to help her daughter do anything in the game. Quite the contrary actually. All that she was asking for was a change to an existing title acknowledging a partial achievement. THAT IS ALL. And would we, as the community, support such a change so that people like her daughter could show this achievement. Period. So stop assuming, actually spend time reading all of the posts, and think. But it seems you have answered the question that you have no issue with this title change and thats all we were asking for. Thank you for that.

Reagan · Feb 22, 2009, 08:17 PM // 20:17

Thank you, DragonRogue! You are a true advocater! And thanks to everyone who made mature comments.

I've looked at a lot of these comments and taken a lot in stride no matter how rude they were because it's part of life when others take what they have for granted. If it comes easy to someone, they think it should come as easy to every one else. AND THERE IS NO COMPASSION FOR THOSE WHO CAN'T DO WHAT THEY CAN! That's why we have ppl in game calling each other names. It seems many think they are better than those who don't quite get it.

But enough is enough. Let's not argue anymore...PLEASE. We will all have our own opinions throughout life based on what is placed in front of us. I'm not angry or upset with any of you. I asked for comments, knowing full well that I would get negative ones, yet I put myself out there. I don't care what you think of me or my daughter or anyone else who might have a disability, but let's end it here.

I don't know how to ask for the forum moderator to lock this thread, but I'd like that to be done. I'm not going to have my opinon be the cause for an argument here. It's a game. We've discussed it to death. Let it be over.

Thank you to everyone! I'm serious...even those of you who don't understand. Maybe when you come across someone else in your life who can't do exactly what you can, you'll have a little more compassion. That's not to enable the person, but just not be so arrogant. I smile of understanding goes a lot further than you might think.

IT'S OVER! NO MORE PLEASE!